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Post by tits on Sept 8, 2005 16:12:12 GMT -8
The BBC did a piece on Sept 7th concerning the closing ceremonies for the 60th anniversary of WWII. The week long conference included a panel discussion of the subject. Experts from Japan,the UK, and American presented their "learned opinion."
Basically, Japan said that most in Japan wanted to avoid a war with American but realized that war with Russia was unavoidable. That if the US had not misread the mail in October and November, that Pearl Harbor would not have happened. Thereby missing the only opportunity for a surprise attack. I.E. no war with America.
Now for me, if no war with Japan, would there have been no war with Germany in 1942. Therefore, Germany would have controlled the Sahara and WWII would have gone to the Nazis.
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Post by peterd on May 27, 2006 12:00:54 GMT -8
It is possible, however how do we know what Tojo and his gang had in mind. Did they realy spoke the truth during their trials. What about war plans which we will never know because those involved committed suicide.
We also have to look at German-Japanese agreement. How much we know about it? I believe that there are many questions which will never be answered. l
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Post by santee on Jun 24, 2006 2:08:25 GMT -8
I'm not quite sure that would be a good interpretation. True, the Japanese people might not have wanted war, but the Japanes Government at that time wanted war. It comes from the Superior mentality of that time after war in China and Manchuria.
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Post by MrDoublel on Jun 24, 2006 2:43:31 GMT -8
I find it hard to believe the Japanese wanted to go at it with the Soviets. Especially after the drubbing they got handed by the Red Army in the late thirties (I forget what year). Also the Japanese were very unhappy with the US cutting off their oil and steel supplies.
I think what we have he-ah, is revisionist history.
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Post by Remey688 on Jun 25, 2006 4:06:09 GMT -8
I find it hard to believe the Japanese wanted to go at it with the Soviets. Especially after the drubbing they got handed by the Red Army in the late thirties (I forget what year). Also the Japanese were very unhappy with the US cutting off their oil and steel supplies. I think what we have he-ah, is revisionist history. In part Japanese aggression banked on the US not wanting to enter the European War, or esculating it to the World War it became. |
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Post by MrDoublel on Jun 25, 2006 5:49:17 GMT -8
They misunderestimated (Sorry 'bout that, I just had to.) our will to fight, as did Hitler. The thought we were weak. Plus there was the whole racial superiority thing too.
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Post by santee on Jun 27, 2006 11:18:34 GMT -8
The only way that Japan would not have brought us into war was to have kept on attacking in China with no attacks in the islands. We had to much presence everywhere for that to happen. Problem with that was that anywhere Japan looked, we had a base or a presence. And no pressure they applied would have driven us out.
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Post by tits on Jul 7, 2006 7:51:30 GMT -8
Supposedly it was built and test detonated in August 45 on a island in norther Korea. The Soviets took all the stuff and used themselves. The piece on the BBC Discovery/Times had only three Japanese nuclear physicist they interviewed. All stated that it had been tested on August 11th. All stated the intent was to lure the American armada into a bay before the invasion and to detonate the bomb over the fleet.
Since we have broached the subject of revisionist history. I have no reason not believe the BBC but is this a true story.
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Post by peterd on Jul 7, 2006 8:57:24 GMT -8
BBC has good program on his history and facts. However todays comentaries are little bit off. I done some studies on ANZACS and started at BBC and then I went to suggested sites (outside BBC) and eventually found historical facts.
As for Japan, they seem to be more into bio-chem warfare (Unit 709) then nuclear. What is upsetting that some of the scientists from unit 709 were never put on trial for atrocities they committed. Instead for their freedom they gave US their secrets.
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majork
Junior Member
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Post by majork on Aug 12, 2006 10:11:23 GMT -8
I would take the statement that Japan did not want to go to war with the US with a grain of salt. Actually, maybe a 50-lb bag of salt would be better.
Japan needed an independent source for raw materials. Our embargo proved that they could not count on external sources. Sort of like us and our oil.
Japan decided that Southeast Asia had the raw materials they needed. Their plan was to:
-- Seize and control areas with the needed resources.
-- Establish a security zone around those areas using the Imperial Navy out of remote land bases.
To accomplish this, they had to eliminate the American fleet, which was the only real threat to them. The British, French, and Dutch were very busy in Europe.
Now, I DO think that the Japanese had no intention of a prolonged war with the United States. Their assumption at the start of hostilities was that we would negotiate a peace agreement that would leave us free to support our white friends in Europe, and leave them free to dominate the Far East.
That didn't happen, of course.
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Post by peterd on Aug 12, 2006 10:48:22 GMT -8
I don't believe that Japan would leave us alone. Japan had pact with Hitler and eventually we would been faced with two war fronts. US went to help Britain. Britain fought Japan, so we would beeen there anyway.
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majork
Junior Member
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Post by majork on Aug 13, 2006 8:31:37 GMT -8
Hitler wanted Japan to attack Russia through Siberia. When they didn't, Stalin was free to ship his hordes of Asian troops against the Nazis in the West. I am not so sure Japan would have kept up their end of the Tripartite Pact as faithfully as Hitler did.
But, in spite of what is taught in Leftist Indoctrination Centers (aka public schools), Hitler's biggest mstake was NOT opening up a "Second Front" against Russia. If Russia was a second front, where was the first? France had fallen, and the British were holed up on their island. There wasn't any place in Western Europe where German troops and any other troops faced each other on the ground.
Britain was capable of launching raids into Occupied Territory, air and commando, but was not able to conduct any serious attacks.
Hitler's mistake was in supporing the Japanese by declaring war against the US. Having left a base in his own rear (England) he now declared war against the one country that could actually make good use of it for a counterattack.
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Post by tits on Aug 29, 2006 19:27:45 GMT -8
I would take the statement that Japan did not want to go to war with the US with a grain of salt. Actually, maybe a 50-lb bag of salt would be better. Japan needed an independent source for raw materials. Our embargo proved that they could not count on external sources. Sort of like us and our oil. Japan decided that Southeast Asia had the raw materials they needed. Their plan was to: -- Seize and control areas with the needed resources. -- Establish a security zone around those areas using the Imperial Navy out of remote land bases. To accomplish this, they had to eliminate the American fleet, which was the only real threat to them. The British, French, and Dutch were very busy in Europe. Now, I DO think that the Japanese had no intention of a prolonged war with the United States. Their assumption at the start of hostilities was that we would negotiate a peace agreement that would leave us free to support our white friends in Europe, and leave them free to dominate the Far East. That didn't happen, of course. Heck, they could have achieved that goal if they had taken lessens from the Vietnameze and the Democrats were in office then that have been since 1968. ;D |
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