Catholic Tradition

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Sacred Scripture is the speech of God as it is put down in writing under the breath of the Holy Spirit.

And Holy Tradition transmits in its entirety the Word of God which has been entrusted to the apostles by Christ the Lord and the Holy Spirit. It transmits it to the successors of the apostles so that, enlightened by the Spirit of truth, they may faithfully preserve, expound, and spread it abroad by their preaching.

As a result the Church, to whom the transmission and interpretation of Revelation is entrusted, does not derive her certainty about all revealed truths from the holy Scriptures alone. Both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honored with equal sentiments of devotion and reverence.

The Tradition here in question comes from the apostles and hands on what they received from Jesus' teaching and example and what they learned from the Holy Spirit. The first generation of Christians did not yet have a written New Testament, and the New Testament itself demonstrates the process of living Tradition.

Protestants, in error, believe that everything, all revelation, and all that there is to be known, is in the Bible. This is incorrect. This belief was handed down to them by their Protestant reformers. Originally fabricated by Luther, it has been carried down to modern day Protestants for 500 years.

Have any of you Protestants desire to comment on this? You too Tittus.

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[tits]

The funny thing is that I found that I visualized Tevye for the entire discussion in Habakkuk. Though Tevye is a Czarist Jew living in eastern Ukraine, he describes all of us.

A fiddler on the roof. Sounds crazy, no? But here, in our little village of Anatevka, you might say every one of us is a fiddler on the roof trying to scratch out a pleasant, simple tune without breaking his neck. It isn't easy. You may ask 'Why do we stay up there if it's so dangerous?' Well, we stay because Anatevka is our home. And how do we keep our balance? That I can tell you in one word: tradition!

and then later
Traditions, traditions. Without our traditions our lives would be as shaky as, as... as a fiddler on the roof!

And then, still later:

Because of our traditions, we've kept our balance for many, many years. Here in Anatevka, we have traditions for everything... How to sleep, how to eat... how to work... how to wear clothes. For instance, we always keep our heads covered, and always wear a little prayer shawl that shows our constant devotion to God. You may ask, "How did this tradition get started?" I'll tell you!

I don't know. But it's a tradition... and because of our traditions... Every one of us knows who he is and what God expects him to do.

Cat, though you know my heart, I must compliment you on your observation. Contrary to what many "fellowshipping Christians" proclaim, most believe and worship purely out of tradition. Why do Lutheran's beget Lutherans, Mormons beget Mormons, Church of Christ beget Church of Christ, and Catholic beget Catholics? The same reason Sunis beget Sunis, Shias beget Shias, Buddhist beget Buddhist, Hindis beget Hindis,......

TRADITION

The corollary question: why do so many young people leave their religious affiliations in the West? Tradition! When people are searching for the answer to the "WHY" in their lives, they want more than the "It was good enough for grandpa" and "because I said so". At some point in our lives, most of us no longer trust tradition to describe our faith. Many of us no long trust the tradition of society and many of us are burnt for "bucking ths system".

Cat, I agree that tradition is both the bane and the praise of our worship. BUT... Please explain Isaiah, Malachi, Christ, James, and Paul when they condemn worship that is based on the "traditions of men". I will offer those scriptures if you wish, here is one.
Is 29:13. This worship is all idle, empty, and without profit, because they teach as doctrines the commandments of men

To rely on traditions is little different than the Mormons who teach tradition and victimization over scriptures. Here is Paul's quote to Timothy that seems to imply that both Tradition and Scriptures (though he was speaking of the Torah and Talmud) are important: "14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

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tits said:

The funny thing is that I found that I visualized Tevye for the entire discussion in Habakkuk. Though Tevye is a Czarist Jew living in eastern Ukraine, he describes all of us.

A fiddler on the roof. Sounds crazy, no? But here, in our little village of Anatevka, you might say every one of us is a fiddler on the roof trying to scratch out a pleasant, simple tune without breaking his neck. It isn't easy. You may ask 'Why do we stay up there if it's so dangerous?' Well, we stay because Anatevka is our home. And how do we keep our balance? That I can tell you in one word: tradition!

and then later
Traditions, traditions. Without our traditions our lives would be as shaky as, as... as a fiddler on the roof!

And then, still later:

Because of our traditions, we've kept our balance for many, many years. Here in Anatevka, we have traditions for everything... How to sleep, how to eat... how to work... how to wear clothes. For instance, we always keep our heads covered, and always wear a little prayer shawl that shows our constant devotion to God. You may ask, "How did this tradition get started?" I'll tell you!

I don't know. But it's a tradition... and because of our traditions... Every one of us knows who he is and what God expects him to do.

Cat, though you know my heart, I must compliment you on your observation. Contrary to what many "fellowshipping Christians" proclaim, most believe and worship purely out of tradition. Why do Lutheran's beget Lutherans, Mormons beget Mormons, Church of Christ beget Church of Christ, and Catholic beget Catholics? The same reason Sunis beget Sunis, Shias beget Shias, Buddhist beget Buddhist, Hindis beget Hindis,......

TRADITION

The corollary question: why do so many young people leave their religious affiliations in the West? Tradition! When people are searching for the answer to the "WHY" in their lives, they want more than the "It was good enough for grandpa" and "because I said so". At some point in our lives, most of us no longer trust tradition to describe our faith. Many of us no long trust the tradition of society and many of us are burnt for "bucking ths system".

Cat, I agree that tradition is both the bane and the praise of our worship. BUT... Please explain Isaiah, Malachi, Christ, James, and Paul when they condemn worship that is based on the "traditions of men". I will offer those scriptures if you wish, here is one.
Is 29:13. This worship is all idle, empty, and without profit, because they teach as doctrines the commandments of men

To rely on traditions is little different than the Mormons who teach tradition and victimization over scriptures. Here is Paul's quote to Timothy that seems to imply that both Tradition and Scriptures (though he was speaking of the Torah and Talmud) are important: "14But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, 15and how from infancy you have known the holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. 16All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Yes Tittus, good post, except for one very important piece of data. The Tradition that I am talking about is spelled with a capital T. This Tradition comes from God through the Apostles and into our Church. Same as the Bible. As a matter of fact, the Bible is part of Catholic Tradition.

The tradition that you are talking about is spelled with a small t.
It is tradition that is made by man, not God. It could be very important to someone's religion, but it can be changed. This is the tradition that Christ condemned. It's mindless. It led to the Saducees and the Pharisees and the corruption of power that they so willingly manipulated.

While Jesus lived with the Apostles, there was no Tradition with the capital T, that is other than what He taught the Apostles. To call our Traditions a lie would be to call Jesus a liar. Why? Because He gave them to us.
Protestants have already taken much of Catholic Tradition and use it. Every time they read the Bible they are participating in Catholic Tradition. Your Protestant reformers have lied to you, cheated you, and left you on a precipiece without so much as a glass of water. Thank God for the Roman Catholic Church!

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All the Protestants must know all this is true or they would have challenged it. Or maybe, they don't know how to challenge it. Their reformers didn't show them how to challenge it.

C.

[tits]

Traditions are the guideposts driven deep in our subconscious minds. The most powerful ones are those we can't even describe and aren't even aware of.

"Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power." Colossians 2:8-10

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Your absolutely correct Tittus. That's why I am a Catholic. That's why I hold the Tradition and the Bible given to us by Jesus Christ.
How can you, along with the rest of the Protestants, be so gullible as to follow those reformers. Unbelievable!!

C.

[tits]

1Then some Pharisees and teachers (Catholics and the Cardnials) of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem (Rome) and asked, 2"Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don't wash their hands before they eat!" 3Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition? 4For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and 'Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.' 5But you say that if a man says to his father or mother, 'Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is a gift devoted to God,' 6he is not to 'honor his father' with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition. 7You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
8" 'These people honor me with their lips,
but their hearts are far from me.
9They worship me in vain;
their teachings are but rules taught by men.'"
10Jesus called the crowd to him and said, "Listen and understand. 11What goes into a man's mouth does not make him 'unclean,' but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him 'unclean.' "
12Then the disciples came to him and asked, "Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this?"

13He replied, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots. 14Leave them; they are blind guides.If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit."

15Peter said, "Explain the parable to us."

16"Are you still so dull?" Jesus asked them. 17"Don't you see that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then out of the body? 18But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man 'unclean.' 19For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. 20These are what make a man 'unclean'; but eating with unwashed hands does not make him 'unclean.' "

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Thank you for writing out Scriptures in the Bible Tittus. I'm sure that you have some reason for doing so, but it escapes me. Please try to be more clear with your posts.

One interesting point that I would like to bring to light. A friend of mine listed all the sexually perverted acts performed by Protestant ministers. There are quite a lot of them. Does the name Jimmy Jones ring a bell? He was only one of many.

So let's hear it Tittus. What is the purpose of your post?

This is a typical offense on your part. You cannot defeat me with the facts so you try to baffle me with BS. You have absolutely nothing to say about Tradition. You don't know how to combat it. It is unique to the Catholic Church and it has been around from the beginning of Christianity. This is just one more reason why the Catholic Church is the one true Church.

C.