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Post by bounce on May 20, 2006 14:18:25 GMT -8
How do you know that they had no chance? Did they try?
Why wouldn't they have a chance? I don't get that either.
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 14:46:00 GMT -8
"You're making an argument that it's not just for them to be allowed to stay becouse the jumped in front of the line. Well these people never had any chance of getting on line how is that just?" Then why the hell should they get to stay? How is THAT just? They are here already they had our tacit aproval to be here and work. How is it just to now say thanks for cutting the grass time to go. |
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 14:49:21 GMT -8
How do you know that they had no chance? Did they try? Why wouldn't they have a chance? I don't get that either. How many illiterate peasants do you think we let on the line? Come on, honest debate. |
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Post by bounce on May 20, 2006 15:00:12 GMT -8
AHHHHHH, now you're starting to make sense...
The problem you have is with your use of the term "Our tacit approval."
"Our" in a legal sense means the US government.
The US government NEVER changed the law and it has ALWAYS been against the law to cross the border without going through a port of entry.
"Tacit Approval" was NEVER GRANTED and they've been criminals every single day they've been here and they know it.
Pretty close! I'd think it means, "You're lucky to have been here this long, you have been a criminal everyday since you got here and we're going to fine the shit out of whoever employs you if you stay."
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Post by 101ABN on May 20, 2006 15:00:55 GMT -8
Bullshit! They broke the law by coming and broke the law by staying. They don't get to stay, Goddammit! "Pretty close! I'd think it means, "You're lucky to have been here this long, you have been a criminal everyday since you got here and we're going to fine the shit out of whoever employs you if you stay." Yes! And you knew goddam well it was illegal and you came anyway thinking you'd never get caught. |
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:03:10 GMT -8
AHHHHHH, now you're starting to make sense... The problem you have is with your use of the term "Our tacit approval." "Our" in a legal sense means the US government. The US government NEVER changed the law and it has ALWAYS been against the law to cross the border without going through a port of entry. "Tacit Approval" was NEVER GRANTED and they've been criminals every single day they've been here and they know it. Pretty close! I'd think it means, "You're lucky to have been here this long, you have been a criminal everyday since you got here and we're going to fine the shit out of whoever employs you if you stay." This is a repost of a response I've already given several times: We have done nothing up to this point in time to lift a finger to stop them from coming in or from getting a job once they are here, have we? It matters not at all that no one here personally gave their approval, we as a nation were in fact sending a message to these people. Now how many people do you suppose got up and left to never return to their favorite eatery when they realized the bus boy didn't speak any English? How many home owners made sure the contractor's laborers putting on the new edition to their home, all had their papers? Do you suppose they went with the guy that seemed to be able to do what they wanted for the least amount of money. Not really looking to close at who was putting up the dry wall. Here on Long Island landscapers are every where. How many people do you think check to make sure the guy they hire only uses documented labor? I could go on and on. Are you starting to see my point? We the people of the United States were not a bunch of innocent bystanders who were let down by our politicians when it comes to this "invasion". We as a whole were in fact complicit in allowing these people in. Maybe not you or me personally but as a nation that really can't be denied. So the way I see it all the self righteous anger is misplaced. We created the problem and we can solve the problem in a way that is just and equitable to all. |
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Post by 101ABN on May 20, 2006 15:05:07 GMT -8
Bullshit then and bullshit now.
None of this matters, Cameron.
At the end of the day you're just as wrong as you were at the beginning.
They have no right to be here.
You apparently are incapable of grasping that and want to afford that right to them.
I can only conclude that you are delusional.
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:06:19 GMT -8
Bullshit! They broke the law by coming and broke the law by staying. They don't get to stay, Goddammit! The only ones being fooled by thinking we can force them to leave now that they are here, are the ones who think that. They broke the law big bloody deal so what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? |
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Post by bounce on May 20, 2006 15:06:51 GMT -8
How do you know that they had no chance? Did they try? Why wouldn't they have a chance? I don't get that either. How many illiterate peasants do you think we let on the line? Come on, honest debate. Why does that matter? What it 100,000,000 illiterate peasants wanted in, would you let them all in? What about 300,000,000? The world of illiterate peasants ARE NOT OUR MAKING AND ARE NOT OUR PROBLEM! What do you suppose illiterate peasants will to to benefit this country? Take a look at the auto unions. Labor is being replaced by robots every day and I'll bet someone's working on a lettuce picking machine as we speak. The world's poor are NOT our problem. You know, you are sounding more and more like Karl Marx every day. I think the illiterate poor should stay where they are and make products for Wal*Mart. |
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:09:42 GMT -8
Bullshit then and bullshit now. Direct and to the point. I will take your critique and file it under bullshit. Thanks for your input. |
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Post by jfree on May 20, 2006 15:10:59 GMT -8
I am anti-illegal immigration, not anti-immigration. When you set presedents in bending to the will of invaders you only invite more. You want an example, how about the 86 amnesty.
The only people we need to be just and fair to are American Citizens, that is it. No one else has the right to demand we bend to their will. Hey why don't we just let the UN tell us what to do.
The reality is, these people are here criminally, every day they stay is a crime, when they go to work they commit a crime when they don't pay taxes they commit a crime, when they forge documents they commit a crime, when they do file taxes under a forged identity another crime. They are criminals. Would you commit forgery? Would you evade your taxes?
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:11:04 GMT -8
How many illiterate peasants do you think we let on the line? Come on, honest debate. Why does that matter? What it 100,000,000 illiterate peasants wanted in, would you let them all in? What about 300,000,000? The world of illiterate peasants ARE NOT OUR MAKING AND ARE NOT OUR PROBLEM! What do you suppose illiterate peasants will to to benefit this country? Take a look at the auto unions. Labor is being replaced by robots every day and I'll bet someone's working on a lettuce picking machine as we speak. The world's poor are NOT our problem. You know, you are sounding more and more like Karl Marx every day. I think the illiterate poor should stay where they are and make products for Wal*Mart. We are talking about line jumping remember? I said line jumping was a red herring and it is. |
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Post by 101ABN on May 20, 2006 15:13:49 GMT -8
"They broke the law big bloody deal so what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? "
It has more to do with the price of frijoles in Los Angeles.
But I hear you, Fuck the law, Fuck the rule of Law, Fuck the Constitution and the Bill of Rights too.
Let's legalize these illiterate souls, make them our indentured servants, and support their families on welfare for the next two generations. Hell, let's just forget about borders, the English language and any kind of common culture while were at it.
My God, you're fucking mad!
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:14:40 GMT -8
I am anti-illegal immigration, not anti-immigration. When you set presedents in bending to the will of invaders you only invite more. You want an example, how about the 86 amnesty. The only people we need to be just and fair to are American Citizens, that is it. No one else has the right to demand we bend to their will. Hey why don't we just let the UN tell us what to do. The reality is, these people are here criminally, every day they stay is a crime, when they go to work they commit a crime when they don't pay taxes they commit a crime, when they forge documents they commit a crime, when they do file taxes under a forged identity another crime. They are criminals. Would you commit forgery? Would you evade your taxes? Bend to the will of invaders? Get a grip on your self. Criminals? Why? Because the cut our grass bussed our tables and put up sheat rock without permision? This is foolish Morality is the measure of the Law not the other way round. |
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Post by cameron on May 20, 2006 15:15:45 GMT -8
Bullshit then and bullshit now. None of this matters, Cameron. At the end of the day you're just as wrong as you were at the beginning. They have no right to be here. You apparently are incapable of grasping that and want to afford that right to them. I can only conclude that you are delusional. I'm delusional? No you all are delusional and time will tell. |
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